tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post114036337028594375..comments2024-03-27T07:01:13.725+02:00Comments on The Muqata: The Horrible Predicament - Moztei Shabbat MovieJameel @ The Muqatahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15890095633246557332noreply@blogger.comBlogger30125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1167524556093273052006-12-31T02:22:00.000+02:002006-12-31T02:22:00.000+02:00cheating husband<A HREF="http://hometown.aol.com/vaxfahnq/husband-girlfriend.html" REL="nofollow">cheating husband</A>Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140621806366246292006-02-22T17:23:00.000+02:002006-02-22T17:23:00.000+02:00SwiftThinker: Thanks for your comment; you just re...SwiftThinker: Thanks for your comment; you just reminded me of a smiliar situation in "Pearl Harbor" -- granted, its not brothers, and they weren't married, but they were best friends.Jameel @ The Muqatahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15890095633246557332noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140531023321143842006-02-21T16:10:00.000+02:002006-02-21T16:10:00.000+02:00this 'horrible predicament' reminds me of those 'w...this 'horrible predicament' reminds me of those 'would you rather' books. each page gives ya a choice of two options that you must choose between, both equally atrocious. who remembers some of the absurd examples??the sabrahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07134516234799909775noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140474987923020342006-02-21T00:36:00.000+02:002006-02-21T00:36:00.000+02:00Rock of Galilee: Why is 100 considered enough? I...Rock of Galilee: Why is 100 considered enough? It's not a number we really use. There are numbers that judaism considers significant, and they are usually odd numbers too.ifyouwillit...https://www.blogger.com/profile/12399924134798730080noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140448671012070552006-02-20T17:17:00.000+02:002006-02-20T17:17:00.000+02:00amechad: actually, and obviously, they do deal wit...amechad: actually, and obviously, they do deal with the agnua/mesarevet get problems.<BR/><BR/>more on that another posting.Jameel @ The Muqatahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15890095633246557332noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140447153886262412006-02-20T16:52:00.000+02:002006-02-20T16:52:00.000+02:00I want to see them deal with the aguna / meserevet...I want to see them deal with the aguna / meserevet get problem instead.Avihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08329515764832743303noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140433950571567572006-02-20T13:12:00.000+02:002006-02-20T13:12:00.000+02:00ifyouwillit,The ban on bigamy is rabbinic. Part of...ifyouwillit,<BR/><BR/>The ban on bigamy is rabbinic. Part of the ban included an out that if you can get enough people to say that it is ok in your situation, then the ban is overruled.rockofgalileehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07939653236475167491noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140429448205253862006-02-20T11:57:00.000+02:002006-02-20T11:57:00.000+02:00Just a horrible situation all around. I think he s...Just a horrible situation all around. I think he stayed with the second wife, or they agreed to both be married to him. As to what he or they should have done? No way to answer this satisfactorily....the suspense is torturous and I came to this a day late!MC Aryehhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15391548803569665725noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140419855400428542006-02-20T09:17:00.000+02:002006-02-20T09:17:00.000+02:00What is the halachic basis of the 100 Rabbi's sign...What is the halachic basis of the 100 Rabbi's signing the ishur to allow him to remarry. It sounds a bit like "if enough people think you can do it, you can".<BR/><BR/>I am sure it is just something I have never heard of before more than anything else.ifyouwillit...https://www.blogger.com/profile/12399924134798730080noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140419666775886492006-02-20T09:14:00.000+02:002006-02-20T09:14:00.000+02:00I'd go out and get a third wife, maybe even a four...I'd go out and get a third wife, maybe even a fourth. Might as well go for broke.Jack Steinerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16625864271071630940noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140415186883582292006-02-20T07:59:00.000+02:002006-02-20T07:59:00.000+02:00I'd say stay married to both of them. If one of th...I'd say stay married to both of them. If one of them doesn't want to remain "in" then he could grant her the divorce.rockofgalileehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07939653236475167491noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140406363283854802006-02-20T05:32:00.000+02:002006-02-20T05:32:00.000+02:00Of course everyone knows that Tatooine has two sun...Of course everyone knows that Tatooine has two suns, but Luke didn't have to chooss between them.<BR/><BR/>I was looking at it from the perspective that maybe you were implying that Luke was trying to make a decision between the two suns (which he wasnt). He was staring at the sunset out of pure boredom (since Uncle Owen wouldn't let him go to Toshe Station with his friends.)<BR/><BR/>Sheeesh... you say I dont know whats going on.....Jerusalemcophttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17194852862578375352noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140389824223199392006-02-20T00:57:00.000+02:002006-02-20T00:57:00.000+02:00It really is an awful position...From the point of...It really is an awful position...<BR/><BR/>From the point of view of "shoulds" and shouldn't"s, if he found out before the second marriage was consummated, then was it technically a marriage? (leaving feelings out of it, which is, of course, impossible).<BR/><BR/>From a real-world perspective, if he truly loved his first wife, then must-gum is right. And I need to add on to that. No matter how much he loves his second wife, she will always know that he didn't leave his first wife because of a break-up, or a true divorce, or any of the reasons that marriages normally end. It's hard enough being in a "rebound" relationship and knowing it - always wondering if the person you're with is secretly longing for the one he left behind. But to know for a fact that if things had been different he wouldn't be with you at all... her married life with him will always be tinged with an emotional past she can't erase. Even if his first wife remained in the coma, their marriage would be difficult, because she would know that a part of him wouldn't really be hers - they would probably always have spent some time visiting the hosipital together, and have a connection together over the "body" of his "former" wife. Now that shared finite past would be gone, and replaced with a living set of memories that are his alone... and a constant threat to her emotionally.<BR/><BR/>Under those circumstances, no matter how much he loved her, I would call his second marriage doomed from the start. No woman could willingly stay married to someone she always suspected was thinking about another woman. And especially not another woman he used to love, who loved him still. <BR/><BR/>I can't wait to find out how this ends... if it's really true, I feel so awful for all of them...StepImahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16493964460446023478noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140385954158331172006-02-19T23:52:00.000+02:002006-02-19T23:52:00.000+02:00You'd better! We're all waiting...You'd better! We're all waiting...tafka PPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17166682612446711810noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140382715560465672006-02-19T22:58:00.000+02:002006-02-19T22:58:00.000+02:00J-cop: Note the 2 suns on the skyline. Sheesh, for...J-cop: Note the 2 suns on the skyline. Sheesh, for an ex-cop, you don't seem to notice much!<BR/><BR/>Lipa: Sorry, if this were make believe, I would have said so. <BR/><BR/>Tobie: You are correct...he doesn't need to remarry anyone. In the movie, each wife expressed a definite position that he should divorce the other wife.<BR/><BR/>Chana: I knew I could count on you for an in- depth comment analysis...but using a soap opera as proof??! No Broadway musical or agadata? I'll accept it anyway :)<BR/><BR/>Must Gum: I totally felt for the guy - he was in such an awful situation...(not that the women weren't either).<BR/><BR/>Anyway - I'll post a followup on this tomorrow.Jameel @ The Muqatahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15890095633246557332noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140381225565447322006-02-19T22:33:00.000+02:002006-02-19T22:33:00.000+02:00Actually, that sounds kind of prophetic really...Actually, that sounds kind of prophetic really...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140378762329084522006-02-19T21:52:00.000+02:002006-02-19T21:52:00.000+02:00BTW, how does LKuke Skywalker fit into this predic...BTW, how does LKuke Skywalker fit into this predicament? He never had a comatose wife.<BR/><BR/>J.Jerusalemcophttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17194852862578375352noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140378705947171072006-02-19T21:51:00.000+02:002006-02-19T21:51:00.000+02:00why doews he need to divorce wither of them? he g...why doews he need to divorce wither of them? he got the 100 signatures, so halachikly he can be married to both women.<BR/><BR/>What I never understood about halacha allowing bigomy is that it isn't easy having one wife, why would someone want 2?<BR/><BR/>J.Jerusalemcophttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17194852862578375352noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140376371671254792006-02-19T21:12:00.000+02:002006-02-19T21:12:00.000+02:00See, the fascinating thing about all this halachic...See, the fascinating thing about all this halachically is that he is married to both of them. Simultaneously. Having got a waver of the prohibition of bigamy, it isn't a question of re-marrying one or the other. It's a question of divorcing one of his two wives. (That is, assuming that they aren't okay with the bigamy thing...)Tobiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14930468887760990485noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140376135869612802006-02-19T21:08:00.000+02:002006-02-19T21:08:00.000+02:00It is truely a terrible matzav to be in and whiche...It is truely a terrible matzav to be in and whichever choice he makes no-one can critisize him either way. And no-one can make the decision for him...exsemgirlhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13398272406971272000noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140374886826216852006-02-19T20:48:00.000+02:002006-02-19T20:48:00.000+02:00The easiest way to think about this story is from ...The easiest way to think about this story is from the perspective of the two women. Sure, one women is chosen and one is not. One woman will be happy and one will not.<BR/><BR/>But I wonder how many people will look at it from the other side of the coin -- the husband will never be able to live with himself. Obviously, he was dedicated to his first wife because he visited her every day and asked her permission to marry another. If he stays married to the nurse, how will he be able to live happily knowing he left her hanging? On the other hand, if the husband divorces the nurse, he will forever question whether or not he should have married her instead. It is obvious they shared a lot over the years together.<BR/><BR/>If it were an american movie, we know how it would end. The nurse would take a pillow to the first wife and make it look like she committed suicide so that her husband could stay married to the nurse...MUST Gum Addicthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11275184914370002347noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140370519911331732006-02-19T19:35:00.000+02:002006-02-19T19:35:00.000+02:00Wow, I was wondering throughout if it was a true s...Wow, I was wondering throughout if it was a true story. How tragic! Can't wait to hear the ending.JJhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12177030621603250029noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140368063065964402006-02-19T18:54:00.000+02:002006-02-19T18:54:00.000+02:00I think (this has no halakhic basis, it's just my ...I think (this has no halakhic basis, it's just my thought) he has to remarry/ keep the first wife.<BR/><BR/>He only met and fell in love with the kind nurse because he could not, as soemone said above, lead a healthy relationship with the first woman. That doesn't give him the right to summarily divorce her because of it.<BR/><BR/>Let's take a less extreme example. <BR/><BR/>Suppose a man suffers from amnesia (all right, not amnesia, but something that blocks out his memory.) He wakes up in a hospital and has no idea who he is. A kind nurse cares for him, and he falls in love with her. Later on, he decides to enter into a sexual relationship with her, and still later, he proposes to her.<BR/><BR/>Except the man is already married. <BR/><BR/>He had tried finding out about his past and family, but had failed before, so having exhausted all avenues of inquiry, thought he was free and decided to marry.<BR/><BR/>Enter the "other wife" into the siutation. She finds her husband. He doesn't remember her. Finally, he ends up remembering her.<BR/><BR/>So he returns to her, and ditches the other woman. <BR/><BR/>Then, of course, things get very ugly and unhappy.<BR/><BR/>You know where I came up with that whole scenario? Definitely not from my own head. It's from a soap opera called <A HREF="http://www.cbs.com/daytime/atwt/" REL="nofollow">As the World Turns. </A><BR/><BR/>If you actually want to read about the whole scenario, start from the paragraph 'A year later' <A HREF="http://www.soapcentral.com/atwt/whoswho/jack.php" REL="nofollow">on this site.</A><BR/><BR/>Now, if we don't think soap operas are credible sources, let's talk about some classics, <B>Jane Eyre</B> specifically.<BR/><BR/>Mr. Rochester is hiding a crazy wife in his upstairs room. And he wants to marry Jane. It's even possible he could get away with it. Except he can't. Because, like it or not, he is married to the insane woman, and he will not be free until she dies.<BR/><BR/>It's a very unhappy, sad situation. But I think that what happens there is just. Mr. Rochester has had a very hard life, and I feel a lot of sympathy for his character, but he is married to the woman...and he cannot marry Jane, too.<BR/><BR/>Same thing here. The man was married to the comatose woman. He cannot just "divorce her" or dispose of her to get <I>his</I> "Jane Eyre." That's not the way a just world works.<BR/><BR/>Okay...so there you get my view, based on soaps and classics- and still, to me, the truth. ;) What next?Chanahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17655144434904957767noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140366536280141642006-02-19T18:28:00.000+02:002006-02-19T18:28:00.000+02:00Ezzie: Thats what the credits said...and Maaleh's ...Ezzie: Thats what the credits said...and Maaleh's a very serious film school.<BR/><BR/>And wow...comments in chinese. That's a first. And I thought my first foreign language comments would be Arabic (not including Hebrew ;-)Jameel @ The Muqatahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15890095633246557332noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13539920.post-1140365990478547842006-02-19T18:19:00.000+02:002006-02-19T18:19:00.000+02:00Based on a true story!? Really!?Terrible, terrible...Based on a true story!? Really!?<BR/><BR/>Terrible, terrible predicament.Ezziehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12494592434522239195noreply@blogger.com